2024 Season Awards.

[nuraman00]

What promotions did Minnesota have for Gobert for DPOY?

Want to compare their campaign, vs. the Jazz former ones.

 

[nuraman00]

Congrats to Rudy Gobert for winning his 4th Defensive Player Of The Year!

I'm surprised he had such a big lead over 2nd place, Victor Wembanyama.

I also did not like comments that said "enjoy this one, because it may be the last. Victor Wembanyama might win 5 of the next 6."

Even though no one has won it 5x, if Gobert is healthy, why not?

 

[nuraman00]

Ernie Johnson revealed the promo that was sent out on behalf of Gobert.

It was a "retreat kit". He had gone on a 64 hour darkness retreat last offseason. This retreat kit included shampoo and things.

I'll provide more details later.

 

[nuraman00]

Sigh. Less than 24 hours after the MVP is announced, there's a discussion about how certain players should have more MVPs (Shaq, LeBron, Michael Jordan, Kobe Bryant, Shai Gilgeous-Alexander, Jayson Tatum), and how it's "cute" that the guy in Utah got 2 MVPs, or how that PG in Phoenix got some MVPs, or that former Maverick got a MVP.

Karl Malone will never get credit.

And it still disappoints me that some Utah fans didn't even think he deserved the MVP, because his teammate was the "real" MVP.

And the year Kobe Bryant won it, I would have given it to Chris Paul.

 

[nuraman00]

They should just name the week after the MVP is announced, as the annual week where Karl Malone gets his MVPs taken away.

 

[nuraman00]

Rudy Gobert is the Worst Defensive Player Of The Year In Sports.

 

[MHSL82]

Rudy Gobert is the Worst Defensive Player Of The Year In Sports.

Put someone else on Jokic and have Gobert defend someone else and the paint and he’ll look a lot better. Gobert was defensive player of the year because he played everyone, not Jokic 82 games. If Michael Jordan had to guard Michael Jordan every game, he would never have won that award or at least the Jordan he was defending would score less but still a lot. Kobe Bryant having to defend Michael Jordan 82 games would look different than him having to guard him once or twice a season or having to guard 29 different teams.

I saw an analysis of Gobert, where they said that percentage Jokic shoots is lower against Gobert versus anyone else, but Jokic gets high volume of shots off, where they expect a good defensive effort to get the ball out of his hands. Jokic gets the ball from all over the court, not like in the post like Malone. So it’s more difficult for someone like Gobert to prevent that and he is a good enough ball handler with good footwork that I think it is expecting too much. Jerry Sloan used to always try to contain Jordan or someone who’s scoring a lot but stop everyone else. Maybe if they did that? But Jokic is going to get and he’s an assist man.

 

[nuraman00]

Are there stats on how Jokic is shooting with various people in this series guarding him?

 

[nuraman00]

Put someone else on Jokic and have Gobert defend someone else and the paint and he’ll look a lot better.

Nobody cares if Gobert looks better, guarding someone else.

The objectives are:

1). Find a defense that is the most effective in slowing down Jokic.
2) Ideally figure out Gobert's role in that defense.
3). Win the game, and eventually the series.

If all 3 happen, Gobert will get credit.

If any one of the three don't happen, such as Minnesota not winning the series, Gobert will get the blame.

The only way Gobert would not get blame, would be like if it were the 1996 Finals where the stats showed that Michael Jordan shot 36.7% from the field when guarded by Gary Payton.

So if we can find stats like that for Gobert, then his credibility will still be there.

Otherwise, he's never going to be a top finisher for defensive player of the year again.

There's been too much noise over the years about how "he gets played off the court".

On top of that, Draymond Green was on TNT yesterday and he had many criticisms of Gobert. He's had those in the past, but then he had new ones yesterday.

 

[nuraman00]

Remember what happened in the 2001 NBA Finals?

Dikembe Mutombo was defensive player of the year, on Philadelphia, going up against the L.A. Lakers.

Shaq would win Finals MVP and the Lakers would win the series.'

Mutombo, who had won 4 defensive player of the years, would never win another one again.


The same thing will happen to Gobert, if Minnesota does not win this series.

If Philadelphia had won their series, Larry Brown, Allen Iverson, Dikembe Mutombo, and Raja Bell (guarded Kobe Bryant) would have gotten a lot of credit.

 

[nuraman00]

Draymond Green did also heavily criticize Tyrese Haliburton's defense yesterday, so it wasn't just Gobert who did not perform well, according to Green. He said Haliburton isn't even trying.

 

[nuraman00]

Jerry Sloan used to always try to contain Jordan or someone who’s scoring a lot but stop everyone else.

I'm not sure using Jerry Sloan as a positive example is always a good thing. His teams seemed to foul too much in the playoffs, and give up too many 3's. You don't want no fouls, and you don't want too many fouls. You want to play defense without fouling, but then commit fouls to prevent easy and-one's.

Larry Brown had the same trait that annoyed me. There were many games where the opposing team was hitting a lot of 3's, and an adjustment was not made.

They're both great coaches, but can have some tendencies that worked against them too.

In general, there's two strategies. One is to stop the opposing team's best player, and let everyone else try to beat you. The theory is that they won't be able to sustain it.

The other is to let the opposing player get his, but shut down everyone else.

One of them, in a given game, has to work, for the best chance at success.

Ideally, one would start with one strategy, and if it wasn't working, try the other. Then at least you would knew you threw the kitchen sink at the opposing defense, and tried everything.

 

[nuraman00]

Then there's the 3rd strategy, which is shut down the opposing best player, and everyone else. Sometimes that's also possible.

Usually that results in 25+ point wins.

 

[MHSL82]

The other is to let the opposing player get his, but shut down everyone else.

This is what the Jazz tried to do. But I think if the Nuggets stopped Murray, etc. Jokic could get his and Minnesota would have a chance. The question is if the non-Gobert players can do enough to stop Murray, et al. If they don’t, Gobert gets blamed. Rather than everyone else doing their job and Gobert getting scored on but ignored since they won.

Those 13 assists killed the Wolves.

 

[nuraman00]

Rather than everyone else doing their job and Gobert getting scored on but ignored since they won.

But there's also a threshold where letting the opposing player score too efficiently is worse. If he's shooting 60%+, and on pace to average 40 points, then you can't let him get his.

Because it's unlikely your team will shoot that efficiently.

There is also the scenario where everyone else does their job, Gobert gets scored on, and blamed, because Minnesota loses.

Jokic shot 68%. You can't let him shoot that efficiently either. Both the 13 assists, and the 68% FG, hurt.

 

[nuraman00]

If you're letting the opposing player get his, it should be at no higher than 53%. I said 60% earlier, because that's the absolute time when you have to stop the opposing player from scoring.

 

[nuraman00]

Rudy Gobert has been on the losing team 2x when an opposing player had 40+ points, 10+ assists, and 0 turnovers.

2018 NBA Western Conference Semifinals Game 5: Jazz vs Rockets, May 8, 2018 | Basketball-Reference.com

UTA (102) vs HOU (112). Get the box score, shot charts and play by play summary of the Jazz vs Rockets Game 5, May 8, 2018.

www.basketball-reference.com

Against the Rockets, Gobert was responsible for preventing assists (shared responsibility with the guard defender).

Against Denver, Gobert was responsible for Jokic's 68% FG.

 

[MHSL82]

But there's also a threshold where letting the opposing player score too efficiently is worse. If he's shooting 60%+, and on pace to average 40 points, then you can't let him get his.

Because it's unlikely your team will shoot that efficiently.

There is also the scenario where everyone else does their job, Gobert gets scored on, and blamed, because Minnesota loses.

Jokic shot 68%. You can't let him shoot that efficiently either. Both the 13 assists, and the 68% FG, hurt.

I mean, Gobert still tries to limit or eliminate scoring. He doesn’t just let him do it. I just mean that if they focus on passing lanes and stopping everyone else, that might work out better. Or put Gobert on someone else and have someone else that can defend Jokic better. I haven’t seen the series and I know Minnesota has reputation of being a good defensive team, so maybe they are stopping other people I just know that Jokic got 13 assists.

 

[nuraman00]

Unfortunately, they weren't really stopping anyone else. And Jokic shooting 68% is too high, so they weren't stopping him either. If you stop everyone else, then Jokic can score, but not at that high of a FG%. Ideally 53%.

If you let him shoot 60%, then it's going to be hard for your own offense to match that efficiency.

Since Minnesota doesn't have such an efficient player of their own anyways.

Minnesota is playing much better in game 6.